There is a big difference between doing things we might not like, being assigned a task at work not to your particular liking, and being forced into a job by your government. And there is just a radical a difference between reading about forced labour in a textbook and speaking with someone who had experienced it first-hand.

Farmon Asadov is now a PhD researcher at Lancaster University, but before that he spent time as a forced labourer within Uzbekistan’s cotton industry. Farmon is here to tell us about his experiences in a country that only moved away from widespread forced labour in the last decade.

He also enlightens us the history of his country, why cotton has been such an important pillar of the Uzbek economy, and the intensive labour system that involved two million people being corralled by the government for each year’s harvest.

But most importantly, Farmon tells us how as a student he was sent to remote camps to carry out the cotton harvest, receiving little to no reward, and all framed as being his patriotic duty. We hear about the long hours of hard labour in intense heat, the sometimes-impossible quota targets they were set, and the punishments for not meeting them.

We discover the forces that brought about change to the state-imposed forced labour system, the influence of major corporations in the change, and how Uzbekistan tried to get around sanctions when the world clamped down on exports.

We find out how the cotton industry works now; how new markets have been grown; how supply chains have been built with international support; and how quickly new generations have no memories of the old system.

Plus, do your clothes have a label saying ‘Made in Uzbekistan’? Chances are you’ll be rooting around your wardrobes to find out. Meanwhile, Jan is already planning her next holiday on the old Silk Road to Samarkand – joining 10 million other annual tourists to the country.

Find out more about Farmon and his work within the Pentland Centre here: https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/pentland/about/meet-the-team/farmon-asadov

Discover the Better Cotton Initiative in Uzbekistan: https://bettercotton.org/where-is-better-cotton-grown/better-cotton-in-uzbekistan/

And learn about other groups here:

Cotton Campaign Uzbekistan: https://www.cottoncampaign.org/uzbekistan

Better Work Uzbekistan: https://www.betterwork.org/uzbekistan/

GIZ Uzbekistan: https://www.giz.de/en/downloads/giz2021_en_Factsheet_Cotton_Uzbekistan.pdf

Once you go sustainable, you never go back. Careers in sustainability may not always be obvious, but once you get involved in the sector, it has its claws in you.

Richard Mason is Positive Business Director at Pentland Brands – who include Speedo, Canterbury, Berghaus, and many more brands under their umbrella – and is a two-times Lancaster University graduate.

Richard talking us through how sustainability threaded through and was inspired by his studies at Lancaster and went on to influence his subsequent professional roles with the likes of AO and Burberry. And as we consider how we each end up in our careers, Jan reveals a boring teenage rebellion that revolved around accounting, Richard reveals how his mum sent him in the right direction.

We find out how sustainability has grown over the last two decades, and how it no longer sits separately from the rest of a company but rather as part of everything.

As we delve into how corporations consider sustainability in their operations, Richard talks about how businesses balance sustainability and innovation with considering consumers – while not being dragged down by unengaging jargon – and the influence of global politics on business operations.

We look at the challenges of brands selling clothes they do not always manufacture in-house, how clothing brands collaborate when it comes to sustainability in their supply chains, the challenges that regulations present to corporations, and how companies can no longer make unfounded green claims.

Plus, can you ski in Belgium? When is a journalist not a journalist? And did we really find some positives about AI?!

Discover more about Pentland Brands: https://pentlandbrands.com/our-brands/

And you can see the six points to check when figuring out if a green claim is genuine, or take part in a quiz on green claims to see if you understand the rules, here: https://greenclaims.campaign.gov.uk/

Episode Transcript

We’re boarding the EU Omnibus to see how European corporate reporting regulating affect businesses – tens of thousands of them – within the EU and beyond.

The EU has been a major innovator when it comes to sustainability regulation, but it has not come without controversy. Professor Andreas, from the Copenhagen Business School Centre for Sustainability, joins us to talk about the changes that we have seen in recent years, where they have worked – and where there have been issues.

We talk about why the EU gets involved in sustainability directives and regulations in the first place; discover how they have been a pacesetter in the field; and show how regulations are more than just red tape, but also question how they could be improved.

We touch on the ambitions of the Green Deal, the environmental taxonomy, Sustainable Finance Disclosure Regulations (SFDR), the attempts of the Corporate Sustainability Reporting Directive (CSRD) to standardise sustainability reporting, the European Sustainability Reporting Standards (ESRS), and try to understand the scope of the Corporate Sustainability Due Diligence Directive (CSDDD). All the while trying not to drown in acronym soup and looking at the whole as one big system.

We see how thousands of companies have been affected – even if they don’t have to report themselves; how politics has pushed back against regulations, with the USA playing a role from outside; where the omnibus comes into everything (it’s not an actual bus); and the ever-changing nature of regulations, and why that can cause confusion.

Plus, we send Goldilocks on the hunt for just the right level of regulation; come to understand the concept of smart compliance – companies following the rules even if they don’t have to; and we look at how other countries are following Europe’s lead, and may even overtake the EU when it comes to regulations.

And we might even mention Brexit – however briefly.

For an overview of the EU’s Green deal: https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-2019-2024/european-green-deal_en

Information about the Sustainable Finance Disclosure Regulation (SFDR) is here: https://finance.ec.europa.eu/sustainable-finance/disclosures/sustainability-related-disclosure-financial-services-sector_en

And to understand the rationale for the Corporate Sustainability Due Diligence Directive: https://commission.europa.eu/business-economy-euro/doing-business-eu/sustainability-due-diligence-responsible-business/corporate-sustainability-due-diligence_en

What is a taxonomy? Why are they important? How do they touch upon sustainability? And why should anyone with an interest in financial markets pay them attention?

Dr Charika Channuntapipat knows more about taxonomies than most people – certainly than Paul – and is perfectly placed to answer all these questions. Charika is a researcher and social scientist based in Bangkok, Thailand, where she works for the Thai Stock Exchange.

She gives us insight into how taxonomies decide which economic activities are environmentally sustainable, what the key objectives are, and how these and their enforcement can vary from country to country, and region to region. We discuss the concepts of the objectives (to which taxonomies seek to channel funding); Do No Significant Harm (DNSH), and its importance when deciding if an action is considered ‘green’; and Minimum Social Safeguards (MSS), which relate to human rights and community impacts.

Charika also tells us about the overall sustainability picture in Thailand – both environmentally and economically – and how the government has strengthened governance around sustainability and is pursuing ambitious climate change goals.

We learn how the Thailand taxonomy is a living document, that can evolve as sustainable technologies and endeavours become obsolete. And we discuss the importance of varied and local expertise in shaping policies, the complications of involving so many voices in its creation, and how different taxonomies around the world can complement each other.

And find out why Paul and Jan have gone down a road of confusion with stuffed badgers.

Enjoy a taste of the fast-moving world of taxonomies around the world here: https://www.climatebonds.net/expertise/taxonomy/world-taxonomies

And see more on the second phase of Thailand’s Taxonomy here: https://www.bot.or.th/en/news-and-media/news/news-20250527.html

Episode Transcript

Are innovation and sustainability natural bedfellows? Can you have one without the other – and would you even want to?

We’re talking to Barbara Salopek, an innovation strategist; the founder and CEO of Vinco Innovation in Bergen, Norway; a Lecturer at BI Norwegian Business School; and the author of Future-Fit Innovation. She knows her stuff when it comes to innovation and business!

We look at how sustainability (across economic, environmental and social aspects) and innovation intertwine, how each can drive forward and reinforce the other, and how AI can be both a positive and negative force for them both.

Barbara tells us about how innovation means more than just something new – it has to be useful as well – why sustainability and innovation are not one-size-fits all solutions, the importance of long-term innovation over short-term thinking, why we all have innovation inside us – and the problems of lionising certain individuals as innovators, and why it should not be exhausting.

We discuss the problem of treating innovation as a buzzword, take lessons from companies who have failed to innovate in the past, and learn from those who have innovated successfully, and assess what elements can create an environment where innovation and sustainability can flourish – or fail (including politics).

Plus, Jan questions Paul’s levels of innovation and waxes lyrical about Bergen, we try to rehabilitate the reputation of the Luddites, glueless chairs (!), and we dive into the concept of functional fixedness.

You can see more about Barbara’s book Future-Fit Innovation here: https://practicalinspiration.com/book/future-fit-innovation

Discover more about Barbara and the Norwegian Business School in Bergen: https://www.bi.no/en/about-bi/employees/department-of-leadership-and-organizational-behaviour/barbara-salopek/

Find out about the Luddites: https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/education/resources/why-did-the-luddites-protest/

And for everyone looking for 101 uses for Vaseline, look no further: https://www.vaseline.com/za/en/articles/ingredients/hundred-and-one-uses-for-vaseline-petroleum-jelly.html

You need individual accountability if you are going to be a good leader, but not everyone has it.

Sanjay Rishi is a leadership coach with experience around the world, and the founder of @intersections. He is also an Entrepreneur in Residence in Lancaster University Management School, and he comes to us having seen how sustainability and leadership go together (or not).

Sanjay talks us through his nomadic existence, a stint as a film student, and his life consulting on organisational change and coaching leaders – via his studies at Lancaster.

We take a dive into transitions – where individuals and companies are moving from one reality to another, and where old tools and skillsets are no longer relevant. In this context, what are sustainable transitions, and how do you build an organisation and yourself to make it possible?

We look at the conflicts between attitudes and behaviours, the importance of knowing your own role and story – not just what your organisation expects of you, and how intent among leaders plays a big role no matter where you are in the world.

How do geography and generations play a role in approaches? Can younger leaders pull themselves away from the idea that success equals fast cars, big houses and private planes to move towards a more environmentally friendly approach? And how can organisations rewire themselves to consider the sustainability of their people?

Plus, is Jan a good leader? Is Paul planning to start a dictatorship? And do we use the word joy enough?

Find out more about Sanjay here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sanjay-rishi-26-intersections

And read about his thoughts on the interplay between families and business for leaders here: https://doc.your-brochure-online.co.uk/Lancaster-University_FiftyFourDegrees_Issue_20/38/

Episode Transcript

How much will it cost to look after old people in the future? What can we do to help plan for this expense? And what will happen if we don’t prepare?

More than 1.1 billion people on Earth are aged 60 and over – this is how old people are defined (whether you may like it or not), and at 65 you are seen as elderly. That number is only set to grow and grow. So, how do we manage social care and protection?

Dr Qisha Quarina, from Universitas Gadjah Mada in Yogyakarta, Indonesia, is working with the International Labour Organization (ILO) on the costs of caring for older people in Indonesia, and returns to Lancaster to discuss her work.

We look at how the demographic shifts in Indonesia, and the long-term social security situation in the country, including who pays for elderly care once people retire, and what happens in a nation where nursing and retirement home networks still need to be developed.

Discover how the burden of elderly care often falls on daughters and daughters-in-law, the problems that arise when people work in informal sectors with no pension schemes, and what governments need to think about when planning for future societies.

There is time to discuss pensions and retirement age, the relevance of Logan’s Run to modern-day society, the political implications of the issues, the role of the ILO in liaising with governments, and the stigma of putting parents and grandparents into care (including Paul’s cut-price plans for his dad).

Plus, Jan gets touchy about her age, Paul ponders flossing, Qisha joins a disturbingly large group of people who miss the Lancaster weather when they move away, and we clarify for our listeners that Indonesia is more than just Bali (a whole 17,000 islands more).

Find out more about Qisha’s university here: https://ugm.ac.id/en/

And if you want to remind yourself about Logan’s Run, look no further: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan%27s_Run_(film)

Episode Transcript

What can be done to make your building greener? How can centuries old castles and churches be sensitively adapted to the modern age – becoming more sustainable while retaining their historic character?

Alfie Stephenson-Boyles is an architect with Donald Insall Associates, who specialise in conservation and heritage architecture. He brings his experience across working on ancient buildings and new builds to the show, and of working with clients to show them the impact sustainable actions can have.

Alfie tells us how sustainability has grown as a key aspect for clients, and we look at the many ways sustainability and architecture go together; the key issue of decarbonisation in new constructions and renovations; and the importance of considering sustainability from the start of a project and not putting it in as a late-stage ‘eco-bling’ bolt-on.

Discover the difficulties of working in heritage buildings – and the opportunities to make changes; the myths and reality of Passivhaus, and the concept’s application both around the world and in Jan’s home; and the problems with retrofitting UK homes to – in theory – make them more energy efficient and sustainable.

Learn why you should never speak to strangers on a train; what architects actually do – it’s much more than drawing nice pictures with crayons (though Alfie is a self-professed colouring-in specialist); whether Paul rabbits on too much; and about the oil age of architecture.

Plus, ask yourself if Windsor Castle has a podcast studio.

You can find more information about the idea of ‘Passivhaus’ here: https://www.passivhaustrust.org.uk/what_is_passivhaus.php

And the wonderfully named Association for Environmental Conscious Building can be found here: https://aecb.net/

Episode Transcript