In this episode we have a yarn with two Australian women who are still not sure how they will vote in the upcoming referendum on an enshrined First Nations Voice to Parliament. One is a non-Indigenous woman Karyn Meaker, living on Biripi country, who worked for Community and Justice for over three decades in Aboriginal Child Protection and a fierce advocate for Indigenous peoples. The other is a proud Gamilaroi woman, Donna Armstrong (nee Munro) from a famous Aboriginal activist family, the Munro clan from Moree, NSW.

We unpack ABC Four Corner's 'Muddy Waters', media bias, mining company support of the Voice, privatisation of prisons, deaths in custody, what makes a true white Australian ally to First Nations peoples, the importance of listening and the ugliness of social media, fair skinned/white privilege and what we hear from white people who think we are white or racist, tokenistic consultation, racial bias within government departments, dissenting voices being talked down by well meaning white people who know what’s best - the "superiority complex".

This is not anti this or anti that but an open and honest conversation on the voice from a blackfella and whitefella perspective - “ you do what you wanna do for you to be okay tomorrow” (Donna Armstrong). Featuring music by Grant Leigh Saunders and Whitehouse.