Episodes

  • Former NASA Chief: America Has Lost the Meaning of Power | Iran, Artemis II & U.S. Decline

    Former NASA Chief: America Has Lost the Meaning of Power | Iran, Artemis II & U.S. Decline
    May 21 2026
    Former NASA Administrator and Secretary of the Navy Sean O’Keefe returns to At the Water’s Edge for a conversation about American power, strategy, space, war, and national identity. At a moment when the United States is confronting conflict with Iran while also advancing the Artemis program, O’Keefe explores a deeper question: what actually makes America powerful? Drawing on decades of leadership across NASA, the Navy, the Office of Management and Budget, academia, and the private sector, O’Keefe discusses why Artemis matters beyond symbolism, how commercial space is changing the future of exploration, what Ukraine’s battlefield innovation reveals about the future of war, and why America’s alliances and credibility may be among its greatest strategic assets. The conversation also examines the limits of military power, the danger of unclear objectives, the challenge of defense procurement, and whether the United States can still mobilize around ambitious national missions. This is a conversation about more than Iran, NASA, or the Moon. It is about whether America still understands the sources of its own power.
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    1 hr and 9 mins
  • The War That Ends American Dominance | Robert Pape on Iran

    The War That Ends American Dominance | Robert Pape on Iran
    May 19 2026
    The war with Iran may be more than another crisis in the Middle East. In this latest installment of The Escalation Trap, Robert Pape argues that the conflict is becoming a hinge event — almost the inverse of the 1991 Gulf War. Instead of demonstrating American military dominance, this war may be revealing the limits of U.S. power when tactical military strength no longer produces strategic outcomes. This conversation moves beyond the Gulf to examine what the war means for China, Taiwan, Europe, NATO, India, and the future of American influence. Pape explains why allies are beginning to rethink their assumptions, why America’s security umbrella may be weakening, and why this conflict could accelerate a broader shift in the global order. In this episode: Why the Iran war may be a hinge event for American power How this compares to the 1991 Gulf War Why military dominance may no longer translate into strategic success What Trump’s meeting with Xi could mean for Taiwan Why allies may begin making more independent security decisions How the war is affecting perceptions of U.S. credibility Why America may need a deeper strategy of economic modernization What to watch as the conflict continues Key takeaway: This is no longer just about Iran. It is about whether the post-Cold War era of unquestioned American military dominance is ending — and what comes next. At the Water’s Edge delivers practitioner-level insight into national security and geopolitics, bridging academic theory with how conflict unfolds in the real world.
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    37 mins
  • Former NSC Official: The Iran War Exposed America’s Broken Strategy | Negah Angha

    Former NSC Official: The Iran War Exposed America’s Broken Strategy | Negah Angha
    May 7 2026
    Former State Department senior advisor and National Security Council official Negah Angha joins At the Water’s Edge to discuss what the war with Iran reveals about American strategy, alliances, and decision-making. Angha explains how major national security decisions are supposed to move through the U.S. government, why inconsistent objectives and poor consultation with allies can weaken American credibility, and how Iran’s pressure on the Strait of Hormuz has exposed vulnerabilities in the global economy. The conversation also covers low-cost drones, the limits of the U.S. defense industrial base, Congress’s role in war powers, the lessons of Iraq and Afghanistan, and the complicated role of diaspora communities in U.S. foreign policy. This episode is about more than Iran. It is a broader look at whether the American national security system can still align military power, diplomacy, alliances, public support, and long-term strategy in a crisis that moves faster than Washington’s bureaucracy.
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    51 mins
  • The U.S. Is Losing Control | Robert Pape on Iran, China, and the Escalation Trap

    The U.S. Is Losing Control | Robert Pape on Iran, China, and the Escalation Trap
    May 5 2026
    This is Part 7 of The Escalation Trap, an ongoing series with Robert Pape of the University of Chicago tracking the war with Iran in real time. This week, the Trump administration announced Project Freedom, an effort to reopen the Strait of Hormuz by escorting ships through the waterway. At the same time, Iran is working with Pakistan and Turkey to expand overland trade routes, Hezbollah has increased drone attacks against Israel, and conflicting reports emerged over a possible encounter involving a U.S. warship. But according to Pape, the bigger picture is clear: The United States is losing control — not only in the Gulf, but across multiple regions at once. Why Project Freedom may mark a shift toward further escalation How Iran is using Pakistan and Turkey to work around the blockade Why U.S. credibility and influence are declining in multiple theaters What a loss of control in the Gulf could mean for Europe and Asia Why a future Trump-Xi meeting could have implications for Taiwan How the war with Iran may be reshaping the global balance of power Why escalation may now look like the only remaining option for Washington What to watch as the U.S. attempts to reopen the Strait of Hormuz This conflict is no longer confined to Iran, Israel, and the Gulf. It is becoming a test of American power — and the consequences may extend across Europe, Asia, the Middle East, and the global economy. New episodes released weekly as the conflict evolves. At the Water’s Edge delivers practitioner-level insight into national security and geopolitics — bridging academic theory with how conflicts actually unfold in the real world. In this episode:Key takeaway:Follow the series:About the show:
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    43 mins
  • Are We Already in World War III? Ukraine, Iran, and the New Global Conflict | Paul Poast

    Are We Already in World War III? Ukraine, Iran, and the New Global Conflict | Paul Poast
    Apr 29 2026
    Are the wars in Ukraine and Iran separate conflicts—or part of something larger? In this episode of At the Water’s Edge, Scott sits down with Paul Poast, Associate Professor at the University of Chicago, to unpack his argument that we may already be living in a new era of “world war.” Rather than a 20th-century style global conflict, Poast explains how today’s wars can be defined by multiple interconnected theaters, where major powers compete indirectly across regions—and where decisions in one conflict shape outcomes in another. Read is NYT OPED: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/04/12/opinion/international-world/iran-ukraine-world-war.html The conversation explores: What actually defines a “world war” in today’s context How the wars in Ukraine and Iran are strategically connected Whether U.S. and Russian actions across theaters are a form of great power balancing The role of alliances—and why strained relationships may still hold How munitions shortages, oil markets, and second-order effects shape modern conflict Why policymakers may be “making it up as they go” in a rapidly evolving environment And why in a conflict like this, success may mean finding the least bad outcome, not outright victory This is a wide-ranging discussion on how to think about modern warfare, great power competition, and the risks of escalation in an increasingly interconnected global system.
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    1 hr and 5 mins
  • “NATO Is Dead” — Robert Pape on Iran and the New Power Map

    “NATO Is Dead” — Robert Pape on Iran and the New Power Map
    Apr 28 2026
    This is Part 6 of an ongoing series with Robert Pape (University of Chicago) tracking the Iran conflict in real time. Over the past week, we saw renewed efforts to restart negotiations—including a Pakistan-backed diplomatic push—but no meaningful progress. Ceasefires continue to be announced and collapse just as quickly. At the same time, something more significant may be taking shape beneath the surface: 👉 The “third way” between escalation and accepting Iran’s rise may no longer exist. Why recent diplomatic efforts—including talks involving Pakistan—failed to gain traction How Iran may be building a pathway around the blockade through Pakistan, Russia, and Oman What it means for Iran to emerge as a potential “fourth center of world power” Why shifting alliances in the Gulf could reshape the balance of power The concept of a growing power vacuum as U.S. influence declines What escalating coordination between regional and nuclear powers could signal This conflict is no longer just about military escalation. It’s about who fills the power vacuum—and how the global system reorganizes around it. Whether Pakistan deepens its role as a land and economic outlet for Iran Continued coordination between Iran, Russia, and regional partners Any shift from demonstration-level force to direct strikes on infrastructure Signs that Gulf states become direct targets of pressure or instability New episodes released weekly tracking how this conflict evolves in real time. Pape publishes ongoing updates and frameworks on this conflict via Substack. At the Water’s Edge delivers practitioner-level insight into national security and geopolitics—bridging academic theory with how conflicts actually unfold in the real world. 🎯 In this episode:🧠 Key takeaway:📊 What to watch next:🎧 Follow the series:🔗 Follow Robert Pape’s analysis:📡 About the show:
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    44 mins
  • Special Forces Aren’t Ready for Drone Warfare | John Kowalski

    Special Forces Aren’t Ready for Drone Warfare | John Kowalski
    Apr 22 2026
    Drones are already reshaping modern warfare—from Ukraine to the Red Sea to the Strait of Hormuz. In this episode, Scott sits down with U.S. Army Special Forces Major John Kowalski to break down what that means for the future of conflict—and whether America is ready for it. Drawing on real-world examples from Ukraine, Iranian-backed proxy forces, and conflicts around the globe, Kowalski argues that unmanned systems are not just another capability—they are fundamentally changing how wars are fought. In some cases, they are already responsible for the majority of casualties and are allowing low-resource actors to punch far above their weight. The question is what comes next. For decades, U.S. Army Special Forces have operated as 12-man teams built around advising and enabling partner forces. But if future conflicts are dominated by drones in the air, on the ground, and at sea, that model may no longer be enough. Kowalski makes the case that Special Forces must adapt—structurally, not just tactically—including the potential need for new roles, new training pipelines, and a fundamental rethink of how teams are organized and deployed. This conversation explores:– Why drone warfare is accelerating faster than most militaries can adapt– How non-state actors are using cheap systems to create strategic effects– What the U.S. is getting right—and where it may still be behind– How Special Forces could evolve to remain relevant in future conflicts If the current trajectory continues, the next major conflict won’t look like Iraq or Afghanistan. It will look very different. And the time to adapt is now.
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    54 mins
  • This Isn’t a Negotiation | Robert Pape on the Iran War

    This Isn’t a Negotiation | Robert Pape on the Iran War
    Apr 21 2026
    This is Part 5 of an ongoing series with Robert Pape (University of Chicago) analyzing the Iran conflict in real time. Over the past week, multiple ceasefires were announced—and just as quickly fell apart. At the same time, the U.S. and Iran have continued escalating pressure through a de facto blockade dynamic around the Strait of Hormuz. But the most important takeaway from this conversation is more fundamental: 👉 This is not a negotiation. It’s power politics. Why ceasefires and “deals” keep collapsing almost immediately The enforcement problem in international politics—and why agreements don’t hold How both the U.S. and Iran are effectively closing the Strait of Hormuz Why the conflict is shifting toward a longer war dynamic How escalation signals are being used to demonstrate credibility What potential retaliation against U.S. naval forces could look like In international conflict, there is no court to enforce agreements. Every concession can create new vulnerability—and that makes real compromise extremely difficult. Any direct attacks on U.S. naval vessels operating near the blockade line Further escalation tied to strikes on infrastructure (power, bridges) Whether negotiations resume—or continue to break down Signs the conflict is settling into a sustained long-war dynamic New episodes released weekly tracking how this conflict evolves in real time. Pape publishes ongoing frameworks and updates on this conflict via Substack. https://escalationtrap.substack.com/ At the Water’s Edge delivers practitioner-level insight into national security and geopolitics—bridging academic theory with how conflicts actually unfold in the real world.
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    33 mins